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I am just curious about this topic and I figured I would let the minds here debate (or perhaps not debate). If I was to release my tank raised tangs back into the wild (assuming acclimation is done properly much like when we introduce them to our tanks), how, and would, they survive?

I believe based on absolutely no research and pure assumption, that these fish, for the most part, would be able to survive. I'm sure there are some species that may have a higher rate than others, but overall I think it would be fairly easy for them to adapt.

Does anyone have any dissenting ideas or comments? Obviously I do not plan on doing this, but I am just curious about what everyone here thinks on the topic.

Let the debate begin! :popcorn:
 

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Of course "the wild" would be Lake Tanganyika?

I'd say extremely low survival rate. Look what happens when streams are stocked with trout annually.
 

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From What is a trout hatchery

Objections are also raised to the trout hatchery because of the production of what are widely viewed as genetically inferior fish. These fish, when reintroduced to the wild, may out-compete wild fish in the short term, even though they are of a weaker genetic make-up, and may interbreed with them, diminishing the strain. Proving any direct correlation, however, has proven to be very difficult, largely because there are so many other factors at play in the fisheries that it is difficult to isolate just one cause of any problem. For this reason, the debate over whether the trout hatchery is a boon or a bane to trout as a whole rages fiercely.

I think, in the hobby, reintroducing tank raised to their natural habitat is generally considered a bad idea as the fish would be somehow different genetically. Check out the CARES program goals here. Never mentioned is the intention to reintroduce fish to the wild. It's not just a matter of whether they'd survive.

As to the question of whether they'd survive, of course they wouldn't die when they hit the water, but would survive long enough to eventually fall victim to disease or predation just like every other fish. And probably survive even long enough for some to interbreed. I don't see anything to debate there.
 

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ramcrazy said:
I am just curious about this topic and I figured I would let the minds here debate (or perhaps not debate). If I was to release my tank raised tangs back into the wild (assuming acclimation is done properly much like when we introduce them to our tanks), how, and would, they survive?

I believe based on absolutely no research and pure assumption, that these fish, for the most part, would be able to survive. I'm sure there are some species that may have a higher rate than others, but overall I think it would be fairly easy for them to adapt.

Does anyone have any dissenting ideas or comments? Obviously I do not plan on doing this, but I am just curious about what everyone here thinks on the topic.

Let the debate begin! :popcorn:
I think it'd be much like stocked trout. Some may survive but there would be a high mortality rate as they're not accustomed to avoiding predation.
 

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There's a lake near where I live that has had aquarium fish/turtles thrown in it from time to time. The turtles are still there, going strong. Haven't seen any of the fish, though it's a big lake.
 

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In all likelihood, released tank-raised fish will be ill-suited to life in the wild. They'll have to find their own food. And make sure that nothing else finds them as food. They'll need to learn to find homes in the cover afforded to them, and how to deal with other fish they've never encountered before.

If you're releasing the fish to repopulate an otherwise-extinct species, you have to also ask why the species went extinct in the first place. In many/most cases, habitat destruction is a primary/significant cause. Well, the habitat probably hasn't been returned, so the newly-introduced fish will encounter the same issue as their wild ancestors.

But that raises a different question. Given that the tank-raised fish, after generations, have lived off fish food, and in unnatural conditions, when you release them, are they really even the same fish anymore? Or will you find they have different behaviors/diet/preferences, even if, genetically, they might be identical?

I'm not sure stocking trout is a good example, since stocking is done for the benefit of the fishermen, not to establish a self-sustaining population of trout. And it doesn't help to have a large fraction of the population every year pulled out with hooks in their mouths.
 

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they won't be the same fish genetically speaking... genetic drift can be very rapid in captivity with all the poor breeding practices that are common in this hobby.

That said, you'd be surprised at how well these fish can actually survive and thrive... whether it be a reintroduction or an invasion of the ponds here in Florida, these are smart fish and if they aren't nabbed on the first predatory strike then they've learned that it wasn't a good thing that just happened!

I've personally stocked three ponds with native N.A. fish in my time and in each case, a mere 20 or so individuals was all it took for that species to get established and breed healthy and fit young.

My guess is that enough of a reintroduced group would live to see their genes carried forth into future generations.
 

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Interesting question,

I have always wondered how generations beyond the original wild caught specimens differ in behavior. One advantage for fish would be a lot of their actions/decisions are based on instinct instead of a mental process so they would "know" what to do so to speak.

To add to the question,

Would a f1 group of fish have a better survival chance than a f5? f10?
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I do believe that the trout idea may not have as much backing because it is primarily done for the benefit of fisherman. That being said, not all those trout are caught, and therefore are likely to breed and so on. Number6 brings up a good point though.

I used to live in Miami about 15 years ago, and many of the local ponds and rivers were being overrun by peacock bass. It seems hobbyists did not know much about them and how large they would get. Once they got a couple of pounds they were being dumped into local ponds and they became a permanent fixture. Later on the same thing happened with the introduction of tilapia. The Tilapia apparently started wiping out a lot of the local fauna and fish and were spreading like wildfire. These are extreme cases obviously but some small proof that fish can adapt to their surrounds.

All that being said, I do not plan on reintroducing anything I have back into lake Tanganyika. Everything about these cichlids way of life is different in the tank. I just thought it would be a interesting topic. :p

P.S. I would like to know what people think about ahud's statement. Could f1 fish perhaps adapt better than say a f5?
 

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ramcrazy said:
P.S. I would like to know what people think about ahud's statement. Could f1 fish perhaps adapt better than say a f5?
I think it is too simple a question. F5s are not all created equally, nor are all F1s.

If (for all 5 generations) I breed a large group of cichlids allowing natural-ish pairs to form and there is some sort of natural predation or conflict in the aquarium, then those fish will still be pretty "fit".

If I take a single wild caught male and force a pairing to another random female, the resulting fry may be pretty unfit.

In very general terms only, I'd say that more genetic drift is probable in an F5 than in F1s so I might hazard a wild a__ guess that the F1's will be more fit, but it's nothing more than a roll of the dice if you honestly asked me how confident I was.
 

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The reason I gave the annual stocking of fish as an example is that you don't just have to do it once. You have to do it annually. Thus the fish are not surviving and populating the lake/stream on their own in sufficient numbers.
 

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Another thing to think about is disease. The tank raised fish may have diseases/ parasites that their wild cousins have no protection against. Of course the opposite can be said as well.
 

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Heyguy74 said:
Another thing to think about is disease. The tank raised fish may have diseases/ parasites that their wild cousins have no protection against. Of course the opposite can be said as well.
And this is why it's illegal to release fish from our tanks into the wild where I live.
 

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why wouldn't they survive.
P.D released Aulonocara species in many plances they were not native to in Lake Malawi for ease of capture.
So they certainly survived in non native environments.
 

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tirzo13 said:
why wouldn't they survive.
P.D released Aulonocara species in many plances they were not native to in Lake Malawi for ease of capture.
So they certainly survived in non native environments.
I'm not understanding. Were the Aulonocara released in other parts of lake Malawi? If so Lake Malawi is their natural environment. They can easily swim to other parts of teh lake.
 

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i have a feeling they would do quite well, it takes a very long time for animals to loose their natural instincts & for the most part i think they do display them in my tanks so i would give them a fair chance.
 

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Heyguy74 said:
tirzo13 said:
why wouldn't they survive.
P.D released Aulonocara species in many plances they were not native to in Lake Malawi for ease of capture.
So they certainly survived in non native environments.
I'm not understanding. Were the Aulonocara released in other parts of lake Malawi? If so Lake Malawi is their natural environment. They can easily swim to other parts of teh lake.
Most cichlids are bound to the rocks where they live.
They don't wander up and down the lake.

There are many cichlids that are only found at a particular island, or reef, and nowhere else on the lake.

P.D. collected Aulonocara from unique faraway areas, and planted them in easily accessable islands that he knew about.
In this way he would not have to travel far to get certain species.
So a cichlid can certainly live and adapt to an environment in which it was otherwise not found.
So it would make no difference if it was a wild fish, or a tank raised fish, it would be able to survive, as long as there was food for them.
There are many examples of released human raised animals surviving just fine in the world.
 

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tirzo13 said:
Heyguy74 said:
tirzo13 said:
why wouldn't they survive.
P.D released Aulonocara species in many plances they were not native to in Lake Malawi for ease of capture.
So they certainly survived in non native environments.
I'm not understanding. Were the Aulonocara released in other parts of lake Malawi? If so Lake Malawi is their natural environment. They can easily swim to other parts of teh lake.
Most cichlids are bound to the rocks where they live.
They don't wander up and down the lake.

There are many cichlids that are only found at a particular island, or reef, and nowhere else on the lake.

P.D. collected Aulonocara from unique faraway areas, and planted them in easily accessable islands that he knew about.
In this way he would not have to travel far to get certain species.
So a cichlid can certainly live and adapt to an environment in which it was otherwise not found.
So it would make no difference if it was a wild fish, or a tank raised fish, it would be able to survive, as long as there was food for them.
There are many examples of released human raised animals surviving just fine in the world.
Of course they travel around the lake. How did they colonize the lake in the first place. By moving from one part to another. They all didnt just appear there. There are also many open water species that are not bound to any rocks. My point was the water conditions are very similar thoughout the lake. Tthey shouldnt have a hard time adapting to conditions in the same lake in which they are found.

However I agree with you that most fish wild/or not will adapt.
 

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DJRansome said:
Of course "the wild" would be Lake Tanganyika?

I'd say extremely low survival rate. Look what happens when streams are stocked with trout annually.
As an avid stream trout fisherman: a big part of the reason those trout do not have great survival rates and struggle to reproduce is because of poor habbitat. There are other reasons too but given suitable habbitat, new wild populations will emerge.

Btw: in streams with good habbitat, I have found natural reproduction of salmon & trout in some SW Michigan streams.

Coho salmon fry
 
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