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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i will be setting up a 15g tank soon and just wondering which of these
2 fish will make a better feeder supply.
i know its kind of harsh using tangs as feeders but i would like to enjoy watching the parents to.
im leaning towards the multies due to the size of the tank.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
will they be fit in a 24x12" footprint?
yeah i was kind of concern about the multies size but i do like them as a colony.
 

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I have no issue with using feeders myself (although no doubt someone eventually will on this post), but its really not necessary. I keep Tembwe fronts myself and have used swordtails and cyps (expensive mistake that one) as feeders in the past but they don't really seem that keen on them and show far more enthusiasm for shrimp and pellets. In answer to your question though, I'd go for Brichardi and I have bred them in a 2' tank with no problems.
I occasionally give them live river shrimp (I think they are called ghost shrimp over there) and they love them - easily available from my lfs, but nutritionally not that great.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
i understand about feeders but fish eat fish in the wild.
i feed 3-4" cyphos with 1.5" goldfish and they just love them.
usually give them about a dozen feeder fish and they only last for about 2 days max.
but the bad thing with feeders from the lfs is i dont know if they are clean and healthy. thats why i want to grow my own.
maybe ill just use convicts, that way i dont offend anyone here in this Tang section.
 

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You can easily have a breeding pair of brichardi in a 1'x2' footprint. That's the exact set-up I had for my first pair - first fish I ever bred. Growing out the fry will take a lot of work, though, you know...
 

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personally id just go with some kinda live bearers. i have bred swordtails before and they can release huge numbers rather quickly. also you can pick and choose some rather brightly colored ones. (perhaps it will get the fronts more motivated) and hey they are cheap as dirt! GL to ya. (just know swords can get up to 5 inches as adults)
 

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Fish eat fish in the wild is not good logic. Nutritionally, feeders are pretty much useless unless you gut load them IMO. They obviously can't compete with a good pellet. The good foods are made out of fish and krill, ect anyway.

On the other hand, feeding feeders is fun! I would for sure raise my own if I was going to feed feeders. Convicts would be an easy and fun feeder source. Multi's seem too much of a pain to deal with.
 

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i'd be careful feeding too many goldfish, i've heard they cause liver problems if used over long periods of time. i've used guppies alot bc they breed like rabbits, although a n. brichardi colony is a treat unto itself and they'd make good feeders.
 

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Sick.
Glad this is not a common practice.
It may even be illegal here in the UK. Funny enough we give all pets some rights under the Animal Welfare Act 2006
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/45/contents

"Under [Section] 4 of the 2006 Act it is an offence to cause unnecessary suffering to animals under the control of man."

DEFRA say that it " may be considered as causing unnecessary suffering to either the prey or, conceivably, the predator if the prey injures the predator in any struggle."

On the more practical front for every g of fish you get you have to put in 10g of food.
So wasteful as well as sick and cruel.

But I guess that's what it was posted here for.

To try and outrage folk.

Hope your glad you succeeded.

All the best James

PS I guess I should warn you that these cichlids get dorsal spines very early and this can choak suprissingly large fish to death.

Pic of an unfortunate fish that tried to eat a shelly.

 

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i will be setting up a 15g tank soon and just wondering which of these
2 fish will make a better feeder supply.
The brichardi will grow larger, more quickly, but neither will give you the numbers you need for a 'feeder' supply. You might try one of the larger lamps that have broods in the hundreds or better. Tetracanthus comes to mind.
 

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I don't think I'd try to use brichardi for feeders. They are smart and if you're not careful, a couple will hide long enough to spawn in your main tank. When they have fry, they can get NASTY! Before long they might take over the tank. My fronts gave the brichardi a wide berth.

Just my $0.02

--- Front-fan a.k.a. Dave
 

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24Tropheus said:
Sick.
Glad this is not a common practice.
It may even be illegal here in the UK. Funny enough we give all pets some rights under the Animal Welfare Act 2006
http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2006/45/contents

"Under [Section] 4 of the 2006 Act it is an offence to cause unnecessary suffering to animals under the control of man."

DEFRA say that it " may be considered as causing unnecessary suffering to either the prey or, conceivably, the predator if the prey injures the predator in any struggle."

On the more practical front for every g of fish you get you have to put in 10g of food.
So wasteful as well as sick and cruel.

But I guess that's what it was posted here for.

To try and outrage folk.

Hope your glad you succeeded.

All the best James

PS I guess I should warn you that these cichlids get dorsal spines very early and this can choak suprissingly large fish to death.

Pic of an unfortunate fish that tried to eat a shelly.

I think its both entertaining and interesting to watch predatory fish stalk prey items. In Toronto you'll never be able to unload all the offspring brichardi produce, so I think this is an intelligent way to experience the breeding practices of a fish coupled with a responsible plan for culling all the unwanted offspring. I mean fish pellets are predominantly made up of ground up fish so I'm not sure what the problem is. :lol:
 

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Hi Darkside. Yep it can be interesting "I think its both entertaining and interesting to watch predatory fish stalk prey items."
Someone said its fun to feed young cichlids to larger cichlids. In tanks! How much fun is that?
I for one think they should get out more. :lol:
No problem its a silly post and should be treated as such. :thumb:
Kind of ashamed of the heart on the sleve stuff but this stuff is kind of rubbish and in no way interesting to most cichlid keepers and breeders. Except to be careful who you sell or give your fry to.
Seems there are some sad guys who thinks feeding live cichlids to other cichlids in tanks is fun, lots of sick internet posts of vidios of this stuff if you are interested. For sure they should get a life. :thumb:
No educational value except a rather sick source of entertainment. Far exceeded by many others. :wink:
I guess I have to bow to your guess on what sells in Toranto or anywhere but why breed anything that is not wanted?
Go pull some wings of some flys or pop em in test tubes and heat em up until thier head explodes.
Prob keep you entertained for a while too. :wink:

All the best James
 

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24Tropheus said:
Hi Darkside. Yep it can be interesting "I think its both entertaining and interesting to watch predatory fish stalk prey items."
Someone said its fun to feed young cichlids to larger cichlids. In tanks! How much fun is that?
I for one think they should get out more. :lol:
No problem its a silly post and should be treated as such. :thumb:
Kind of ashamed of the heart on the sleve stuff but this stuff is kind of rubbish and in no way interesting to most cichlid keepers and breeders. Except to be careful who you sell or give your fry to.
The may be some sad guy who thinks feeding live cichlids to other cichlids in tanks is fun lots of sick internet posts of vidios of this stuff if you are interested. For sure they should get a life. :thumb:
No educational value except a rather sick source of entertainment. Far exceeded by many others. :wink:

All the best James
When I used to have my mantis shrimp there were few things more interesting than observing the power it was able to produce in order to crack the shells of different inverts. Watching ambush predators is also very interesting, leaf fish and butis being among my absolute favourites, in fact I'm thinking that if I can get some for of butis again I'll unload my trophs and get back into brackish.

Regardless of whether or not you find any enjoyment in feeding fish live food doesn't give you the right to talk down to anyone especially given how subjective this concept is. Fish eat other fish, we feed them to one another in both live and powdered form. I don't see why there would be any difference in the way you would treat a halibut over a Tropheus. Why is it sick and cruel to use cichlids as feeders when its acceptable to use RCS and the like? Why is it frowned upon to use higher vertebrates as a food source for fish? Aren't you always pushing the idea watching how cichlids act in nature? In nature predatory cichlids like Fronts eat other tangs. People are always including fry predators in setups to deal with unwanted culls, its popular in the cichlid hobby and especially among those of us who keep a lot of lamps. I have no space to grow out the fry from my breeding group of Tropheus, but with the tank full of Synodontis I don't have to worry about it.

The way you experience the hobby is your own, its subjective and what you find morally reprehensible is not the same for others. This is large, popular hobby with many different view points including those that keep predatory fish. Essentially you're killing an animal when you decide to use it as live food, but you're also condoning this same concept every time you eat a steak or a piece of pork loin. Its pretty silly the way some animals are seen as food and others as pets when in truth no animal really wants to be eaten (aside from some parasites).

If the OP doesn't mind hunting and eating meat, chances are they won't mind breeding and using live feeders as a supplement. Its all subjective and if they want to go ahead with the plan I'd suggest a brichardi type due to interesting parental behaviours and easy fry collection (no shells). They're a perfect fit for a 15 gallon aquarium.
 

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i will be setting up a 15g
Missed that initially. Better stick with something like the multi's. You'll both enjoy them and have an outlet for excess fry when it happens. But, like Darkside suggests, the brichardi will be easier to harvest. If you want to have a steady stream of fry, then the large lamps in a larger tank would be an option.
 

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Hi Darkside,

"Why is it frowned upon to use higher vertebrates as a food source for fish?"

Seems that in the UK our legislators think that vertebrates in our care have the right to be looked after and not treated in a cruel way.
Must say I agree with them.
The idea I think is once we own them then there is this concept of a duty of care.
I understand that this is a very European concept and has few followers outside the more green movement animal rights types but strangely this attitude is becoming ever more common. Sorry if I appear to talk down to folk but acceptance of the practice of using vertebrates any way we feel like is I think becoming out of date, as we become more civilised.

It is stretching this a bit to say do not feed unwanted fry to other fish.
I think fry is exempt from this but I dunno why.
Tend to think, is this something one would do in front of folk one wants to have a good impression of one?
If not, then do not do it.

All the best James
 

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mel_cp6 said:
i will be setting up a 15g tank soon and just wondering which of these
2 fish will make a better feeder supply.
i know its kind of harsh using tangs as feeders but i would like to enjoy watching the parents to.
im leaning towards the multies due to the size of the tank.
Did you get the info you needed? Just trying to bring it back. :) This could easily go off track into something you weren't looking for.
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
yes i did Tim.
i think i will go towards the multies because i actually do like them and
like i mentioned before i want to enjoy the tank to.
if i dont use their offsprings as feeders, then i will have another
tank that i can enjoy. :D

no offense to any tang keeper but i am a "tang guy" myself.
*** kept malawis for a short time but been into tangs for 3yrs.

im sure big fish in the wild dies to because they bit more than they can chew.
i would rather feed my mobas clean fish than dirty feeders from the lfs.

but like i said, i may not end up doing this for the purpose of feeding my fronts.
but if i do, im not doing it for sheer entertainment.
 
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