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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi! Is there some who experiment with all ick symptoms but without white spots?

I have 9 yrs experiences with malawi cichlids and a lot much more with freshwater tanks.
I Bought a used 80G tank 9yrs ago with fish included. That was a mix of malawi and other.. As a frequent thing wt the stress of the transportation I got illness in the tank. All symptoms of ick but without white spots. I got rid of of it with pain...many treatment wt different medications.
Since then all other fish not malawi died naturally and remain only with mbunas. I then bring all the right water parameters for these species (Ph 8.0, GH300, KH12-14).
then let say for 8 years with no problem at all doing a water change per wk.
***I don't want to write everything here...take in mind I did a lot a reading and have a lot of knowledge. All my water parameters are stable and correct for malawi cichlids... as a proof 8 yrs wt no problem***

as I had some mbunas with only males after 9 yrs there was not much varieties in the tank remaining (was with 4th generation of greshakei & hybrids) Then some month ago I bring some new mbunas species and some peacock from a certified fish breeder (I know many won't mix them but we also see many with that mix). As I also read it's frequent wt addition of new fish...I got illness again. Exactly the same thing as 9 yrs earlier! All symptoms of ick but without white spots:
-Resting on the bottom/or abnormally hiding
-Flashing/rubbing and scratching against objects
-loss of appetite
-Rapid breathing at the end and rapid death (few days) after that final symptom.

making a long story short... aking for advise at the breeder / used a not effective old medication result in wrong diagnostic and many loss. The breeder still saying me it's normal that they rub against objects and told me to stop medication and let it go... On my side was convinced that was not normal (+ other sign...before they start do die) as since 8 years I'm using seachem stressguard and since that there was no flashing on object at all!
I have a 6" Frontosa in the tank (would not put another one by myself but was there when got the tank and the fish... it is very pacific and never fight with other and never try to eat little fry. I pretty sure it won't stress the other species (for those who'll think that) as the stay and eat in his face and all was going well since 8 yrs again). He was spitting all the food for many weeks (while other species were dying) . He start to stay on the gravel, not moving and not eating for 3 days when I say that's enough.
As I was sure on my side there was illness in the tank.... Healthy fish don't die! The thing is as the begin 8 years ago that was not clear what is the illness as there's no white spots! I decide to use kordon copper-aid. That was crazy amazing results! After 24h the Frotosa start to eat like crazy (was spitting all since like 5 weeks). I kept as recommended the treatment for 1 month. I've tried adding salt before the copper treatment without any apparent benefit. I went much more higher concentration as many can think possible (went to 4600ppm) gradually.

After like 8 weeks with all going well they start slowly to eat less and slowly start again to stay hidden... Again started to raise salt level (as all was going well I bring down the salt level to 800-1000ppm). this seem not helping at all. since the 8 yrs without problem I was keeping the GH to 300 with only epsom salt. But I bring them lately to 5000ppm (with TDS tester) with aquarium salt....look like not helping but no sign of stress or intolérance on the other hand.
As this not helping again I tried kordon Rid ich plus and again in 24h they start eating and moving much more.

As this illness is not 100% matching std known fish disease I'm not perfectly sure of what it is and still having headaches! But I can't figure out that the problem can be bacterial if treating with different parasitic medication dramatically help each times! I know some medication can treat even bacterial/parasitic problem (used in the past seachem paraguard who do both) but with copper... this cannot help with any bacterial problem as I know. Then I still conclude in a kind of ich who don't bring white spots. Rapid breading=gill infection and just learn as it's written on a medication bottle they say when white spots appear the fish can be already heavily infested in the gill and the mouth. This can explain why the Frontosa was spitting all the food for weeks and 24h after copper treatment started to eat like a pig!

Then...Is there anybody who experiment that kind of illness who can help me in any way?
I'm asking myself if I should not go back with copper who did amazing result and stick with the dosage for much more time...? 2 month 3month? is this can become too much toxic for the fish? Or I should do the same like 9 yrs ago and alternate medications each time the illness come back untils I get rid of it for hopefully another 8 years of grace.

Any information/help would be appreciated
 

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If your water parameters are good, could it be what the breeder said to you is true? Maybe all the medication, changing of salt levels, and water quality with the various things you're adding to the water stressing your fish out.

Are you certain your test kit is working right?
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I've tried adding salt and medication (the old ineffective one) because some started to have extreme rapid breathing (added to loss of appetite and frequent flickering)... Not just a bad idea one morning.
With the phenomenal change after adding the copper medication nobody can say these fish have nothing.
 
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