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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I was under the impression that haps and peacocks did not make good tankmates with mbuna. This article seems to suggest otherwise. http://cichlid-forum.com/articles/haps_vs_mbuna.php I'm setting up a 100 gallon (was going to be a 55, but I decided that wasn't enough room...thank you to those who got me to this point with help in that thread) with a blue, orange and yellow theme (p. demasoni, p. msobo - 1 male, the rest female, l. caeruleus) and I'd definitely like to put some haps.

My questions are these:
1. Am I understanding the article correctly that these species can be housed together?
2. What would be good, commonly available choices? I know I can get C. azureus (I'm interested in color so probably just males)
3. The good ol' question...how many?
 

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Peacocks and more aggressive mbuna are not suggested as suitable tankmates. There are several species of Haps that do just fine with almost all mbuna.

C. azureus would likely be fine with the mbuna you have but first I have a good ol' question... what are the dimensions of your 100 gallon? :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
:lol: The footprint is 60"x16" and it's 24" high.

I guess I thought peacocks and haps were pretty much the same thing, so when people said "peacock" I thought they were referring to both. I'm an idiot. :lol:

Some of the haps I like are the c. azuerues already mentioned, c. moorii, p. sevenei taiwan, p. taeniolatus, a. baenschi, a. stuartgranti, o. lithobates, p. electra...so basically all of them, though especially those that have yellow on them. :lol: Do any of those strike you as good or bad choices, or as being more common? I know availability varies by area, so you can't say exactly what's available, but maybe you could give me an idea.
 

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Aulonocara stuartgranti and A. baenschi are a type of peacock. All Peacocks are Aulonocara species. You're certainly not an idiot, you're just learning. An idiot wouldn't be asking these questions. :wink:

The only hap from your list I would keep away from mbuna are Protomelas sp. "steveni taiwan". They can be as passive and shy as any Peacock.

I would choose three more species to add to the three you have and try to keep them in groups of at least 1 male, 2 females. Because your tank is a 5 foot I would stay away from any haps that top seven inches. This would eliminate the Cy. moorii and P. taeniolatus as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Aulonocara stuartgranti and A. baenschi are a type of peacock. All Peacocks are Aulonocara species. You're certainly not an idiot said:
You are too kind, sir. :D

Thanks for the recommendation on the haps, as well as which ones were actually peacocks. :oops: I was going to be surprised if c. moorii had worked, but I'd rather ask a question and get a "no" than just not try something and find out later I could have done it.

I would choose three more species to add to the three you have and try to keep them in groups of at least 1 male, 2 females.
What if I chose 3 species of hap and just kept 1 male and skipped the females? Personally, I'd be happy with 2 females, but my wife loves color to the point that drab fish actually seem to upset her, and I've yet to be able to design an aquarium that pleases her. This is my last attempt to do it. Is keeping male haps absent of females likely to cause trouble? If I'm asking for trouble I'll keep the female haps as Murphy's Law seems to work overtime in my aquariums. However, if it's not likely to cause trouble, I'd just as soon leave them out.
 

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You could get away with a bunch of male haps. You're essentially setting up an all-male tank, with a few female mbuna, which I've found never seem to get hassled by the male haps.

Give it a shot, just be prepared to remove any troublemakers. You could also get away with single larger males such as the Cy. moorii and P. taeniolatus. The lack of females tends to quieten them down some.

8 to 10 males of varying species should be fine.

Have a look at this article and try your best to follow the basic guidelines for setting one of these up.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/a ... malawi.php
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Wow! Excellent article, Joe. Unlike many articles, which raise more questions than they answer, I truly feel I could achieve such a setup if I were so inclined by following the guidelines set forth in your article.

That being said, it sounds like a much higher maintenance tank than I'm prepared for. My wife recently had twins, so both time and money are in shorter supply than the all-male tank would require.

The only 2 fish whose gender concerned me are the msobo for the orange of the female, and the haps because only the males have the color. But if having only male haps is tempting fate, I'll just go with the 3 groups, each containing 1 male and 2 females, as you suggested in your previous post.

Now that we've got that out of the way, how many mbuna do I have room for? Not necessarily specific numbers for each species, as I can work out the numbers to balance the color...just an overall number, if that's possible. I know with p. demasoni, I'll need at least 12. Assuming there are no other restrictions on numbers of each fish, how many am I looking at?
 

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12 Ps. demasoni for sure. A group of 1 male and 3 or 4 female Metriaclima sp. "msobo" would be fine. A group of 6 L. caeruleus would also be OK. Don't worry about ratio with the Labs, they're fine in just about any ratio and they're so difficult to sex when small, it would be futile to try to get a perfect ratio.

Don't expect to keep too much mbuna fry in this tank, the Haps will likely make snacks out them.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I don't expect to keep any mbuna fry in the tank. Breeding is an awesome thing to have happen in a tank, but the nearest pet store to me is about 40 minutes away, and nobody pays well for fish, so it's basically just an inconvenience.

Thanks so much for all your help, Joea. I appreciate your detailed and informative posts in this thread. It's great to have a place to go to get such incredible advice. As with your article, this is one of the few times where I feel like I'm actually ready to do what I've read about. That's not an easy thing to accomplish with me. :lol: Thanks again! :D
 

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If you keep the Mbuna population low and load up on male haps, you should be good. ( I think that seconds Joea) Skip the females for the Haps. Peope who tell you otherwise are Mbuna people. Haps, and especially peacocks don't work by this rule. Males will show to themselves and keep their colors nice. Females will add agression to the tank that you do NOT want.

There are some touch peacocks and haps you can put in the Mbuna tank, but they won't show their potential, but if you keep 1 demasoni and some Mbsobo in your 5' tank? That will work.. and I say this because I've done it. (actually, I've found 2 demasoni work in a 6' tank).
As a matter of fact, you're probably chosen two that will actually show their best colors in with a bunch of haps(yellow labs to OK), most mbuna I've tried in with a large number of haps have trouble showing their color.

Of the fish you listed:

c. azuerues, I like them but they need to feel more comfortable to show their best.. so I give the edge to S. Frieri for the blue color.

c. moorii : meaner than you think! I have a 4" guy that picks on a 7" Tyranochromis.. and everything else in the tank.

p. sevenei taiwan: Just beautiful, one of my favorites

p. taeniolatus: You mean Red Empress? Beautiful fish, but can have a nasty streak, I had a hyperdominant one that could take over 2/3 of the tank! meanest fish I've owned. He's been replaced by a more 'laid back' version. Nice fish.. a must have.

a. baenschi: I've never had one that has shown colors like in the pictures, they also don't seem as hardy as other species, I've had a hard time with these. I'd suggest a Flavescent and Blue Neon for some yellow peacock and throw in a nice yellow lab for pure yellow, you won't get that color from this guy.

a. stuartgranti: really like Ngara, Mbenji, Flavescent, Undu(blue neon).. and the line bred 'rubescens/ruby red'

o. lithobates: Nice choise! doesn't get too big either.. mine sort of stays to himself, but surprisingly, he's not the eye catcher I thought he would be in my tank.

p. electra: Deep water hap! cool fish, doesn't get too big.

So I think I agree with your stock list escept for teh Baneschi.. which more power to you if you can make him work.

I'm going to suggest the Huresi(midnight peacock), T. Intermedius(some call a hybrid), Ruby Red peacock.. and I'm fond of Jacoberfeibergi 'lemon jake'. Oh.. and the Placidochromis Phennichilus! LOVE THAT FISH! But you're somewhat limited in size.

I've found A. Banechi(sp) to be one of the less hardy and agressive peacocks... I've had some trouble with them in a variety of setups.

Check out these photos, many of these fish have shared a tank.

http://picasaweb.google.com/stevebarlow4/MyMalawiCichlids
 

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Remember that this aricle is written by a fellow enthusienst, it has a lot of good infomation, but a lot of it I personally disagree with. Your experience may differe than mine and the author of the article, so don't take everything you read there as fact.
Fish have tendancies,l but they're all a little different.. just like people... so it's not hard science, you can only tell from personal experience.

Personally, I would be careful at best on what you choose to mix, if you choose to mix at all, but depending on your tank size, etc... this may change what might work.

Things I disagree with? The agression level of Frieri, which from my personal experience, is moderately agressive, certainly not very agression. I've had Red Empress and C. Moori that put the Frieri I've kept into hiding. Also, Nimbochomis with an agression of 1? Not from my experience... our experiences are all different, trial and error.. use your brains, read many articles, and make educated decisions and enjoy.
 

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Fish_Dude said:
Also, Nimbochomis with an agression of 1? Not from my experience... our experiences are all different, trial and error.. use your brains, read many articles, and make educated decisions and enjoy.
Where are you reading that Nimbochromis have an aggression level of 1?

Fish_Dude said:
Your experience may differe than mine and the author of the article, so don't take everything you read there as fact.
There's really no 'facts' in that article, just suggestions based on what worked best for me over a two year period of setting up one of these tanks. I think it's obvious to most here that fact based articles, "The Nitrogen Cycle" and "Types of Algae" for example, and helpful articles with suggestions for various setups, are two different animals altogether.
 
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