South American Cichlids • Electric Blue Acara

Discussion regarding only South American Cichlid species. (Oscars, Geophagines, Discus, Apistogramma, Green Terrors, Angels, Severums, Pikes, etc.)

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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Wed Mar 04, 2015 12:48 am

I’ve hoped that the Electric Blue Acara has been bred for color and is not a hybrid. Over the years the regular Blue Acara that is known is considered Andinoacara/Aequidens pulcher, but I’ve also seen A. latifrons sold as Blue Acara. I found a picture that closely resembles the Electric version and it’s possibly A. latifrons. It comes from the Cauca River near Cali Colombia. Check out the info and photo by Rainer Stawikowski below.

This fish comes from higher up in the Rio Cauca near Cali. Rainer Stawikowski also says that this is probably Andinoacara (Aequidens) latifrons.
Photo: Rainer Stawikowski.
http://www.lem.net/alf/THU/And_latifrons_cali1.jpg
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Narwhal72 » Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:56 am

Afraid that this is a genetically engineered fish. It's made by taking eggs or sperm from an Electric blue ram and then combining it with the opposite number from a blue acara. After that the fry are line bred until the color is stabilized. This process takes only a handful of generations whereas line breeding can take dozens or even hundreds of generations.

These fish came from the Asian farms originally where this process is pretty well established. I remember seeing them for the first time at Superzoo 2 years ago and talked to the importer.

There are a lot of hybrids made this way (Synodontis, RT shovelnose, Flowerhorns) where fish that have different breeding strategies such that they would never cross breed on their own are made to hybridize in the lab directly through human intervention.

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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Wed Mar 04, 2015 8:11 pm

Narwhal72 wrote:Afraid that this is a genetically engineered fish. It's made by taking eggs or sperm from an Electric blue ram and then combining it with the opposite number from a blue acara. After that the fry are line bred until the color is stabilized. This process takes only a handful of generations whereas line breeding can take dozens or even hundreds of generations.

These fish came from the Asian farms originally where this process is pretty well established. I remember seeing them for the first time at Superzoo 2 years ago and talked to the importer.

There are a lot of hybrids made this way (Synodontis, RT shovelnose, Flowerhorns) where fish that have different breeding strategies such that they would never cross breed on their own are made to hybridize in the lab directly through human intervention.

Andy


Thanks for the information Andy! I knew they were imported from Asia but haven’t been able to find out any information on how they were created anywhere on the net.

The genetically modified fish I’ve seen, they use a fluorescent protein gene derived from jellyfish or coral. When they inject it in the reproductive organs the fish will produce offspring that are fluorescent and glow under a black light and when those offspring breed they will keep passing it along.

Checkout these videos

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sN6P6kFjrjM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=08nIq_okmrU
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Narwhal72 » Wed Mar 04, 2015 11:08 pm

The genetically modified fish I’ve seen, they use a fluorescent protein gene derived from jellyfish or coral. When they inject it in the reproductive organs the fish will produce offspring that are fluorescent and glow under a black light and when those offspring breed they will keep passing it along.


Not quite. The creator of the Glofish actually did a talk at one of our club meetings a few months back and described how the process was done. Zebra danio eggs were taken immediately after being laid (there was only a few minutes before the membrane would harden) and the fluorescent protein creating DNA was injected into them which then combines with the zebra danio DNA. Then the fry were raised and out of many thousands of attempts they would get a few that exhibited the fluorescent protein. Then those were selectively bred to produce the modern day Glofish.

All of the glofish in the world come from just a handful of these creations. Love or hate these fish, you have to admire the technology and the difficulty it took to create them.

What created the Blue Acara was forced hybridization. A female fish is treated with a hormone (usually BCG) which causes eggs to ripen. Then the eggs are stripped from the female and mixed with the sperm stripped from a donor male. This is actually quite easy to do since the fish have external fertilization. Then they are hatched and raised in a lab. From there it's just line breeding to get the trait stabilized.

Fortunately Acara's and Rams aren't that far apart genetically and were able to breed true. It would be a lot different if it was tried with an Acara and a Red Zebra.
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Thu Mar 05, 2015 12:16 am

Narwhal72 wrote:
The genetically modified fish I’ve seen, they use a fluorescent protein gene derived from jellyfish or coral. When they inject it in the reproductive organs the fish will produce offspring that are fluorescent and glow under a black light and when those offspring breed they will keep passing it along.


Not quite. The creator of the Glofish actually did a talk at one of our club meetings a few months back and described how the process was done. Zebra danio eggs were taken immediately after being laid (there was only a few minutes before the membrane would harden) and the fluorescent protein creating DNA was injected into them which then combines with the zebra danio DNA. Then the fry were raised and out of many thousands of attempts they would get a few that exhibited the fluorescent protein. Then those were selectively bred to produce the modern day Glofish.

All of the glofish in the world come from just a handful of these creations. Love or hate these fish, you have to admire the technology and the difficulty it took to create them.

What created the Blue Acara was forced hybridization. A female fish is treated with a hormone (usually BCG) which causes eggs to ripen. Then the eggs are stripped from the female and mixed with the sperm stripped from a donor male. This is actually quite easy to do since the fish have external fertilization. Then they are hatched and raised in a lab. From there it's just line breeding to get the trait stabilized.

Fortunately Acara's and Rams aren't that far apart genetically and were able to breed true. It would be a lot different if it was tried with an Acara and a Red Zebra.


Thanks for the information!
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Iggy Newcastle » Fri Mar 06, 2015 10:12 am

Thanks for the education narwhal
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Narwhal72 » Fri Mar 06, 2015 11:39 am

Thanks. The speaker who gave the talk is Bill Shields. If you are a member of a local club I highly encourage getting him to speak about the Glofish history. It's really fascinating.

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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Caryphotography » Thu Mar 19, 2015 8:45 pm

I'm trying to determine the sex of my Electric Blue Acara and would anyone happen to know the tell tell differences between a male and a female.

Image

Image
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Sat Mar 21, 2015 9:27 pm

Caryphotography wrote:I'm trying to determine the sex of my Electric Blue Acara and would anyone happen to know the tell tell differences between a male and a female.

Image

Image


That’s a male! The males have longer dorsal and anal fins like yours and are larger and more full bodied. Males seem to have more of a hump on the forehead also. I’m thinking the males max out around 5 inches and the females 3.75 inches but males seem to be twice the body mass.

Female
Image
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:40 pm

So far both batches of fry I pulled are all starting to show the blue coming in.
Image

Another shot of one of the males.
Image
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Jersey_cichlid_guy » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:27 pm

ACC in NC wrote:So far both batches of fry I pulled are all starting to show the blue coming in.
Image

Another shot of one of the males.
Image


Do you pull all of the fry? Would the parents eat them if they were left in the tank?
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Iggy Newcastle » Fri Apr 10, 2015 10:43 pm

Awesome photos guys!
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:54 pm

Jersey_cichlid_guy wrote:
Do you pull all of the fry? Would the parents eat them if they were left in the tank?


I pulled the first two batches just so I would have some fry. All three of the females have spawned two more times and I didn’t pull them and they disappeared. I have the EBA in with a school of large Gold Barbs that are about 3 inches long with a few Bushynose Pleco’s. The females have been spawning about every two to three weeks and usually right after a water change.
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby ACC in NC » Sat Apr 11, 2015 4:55 pm

Iggy Newcastle wrote:Awesome photos guys!


Thanks Iggy!
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Re: Electric Blue Acara

Postby Jersey_cichlid_guy » Sun Apr 12, 2015 10:00 pm

nice
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