Lake Victoria Basin, West African, Madagascar & Asian Species • Jewel Cichlid 3some

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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby easywolf31 » Tue May 30, 2017 8:06 am

Awesome! Very nice. Interesting tank to look at!
145G C. Mobas, J. Marlieris, N. Leleupi
135G Blue Dolphins, C. Kigomas, P. Polleni, J. Marksmithi
75G Green Terrors
60G Peacocks & Haps
60G Brichardis
55G Tanganyika & Malawi Growouts
55G Cubans & Green Texas
45G Electric Blue Jack Dempseys
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Sat Jul 22, 2017 12:21 pm

I found another reporting of a Jewel trio on the internet:http://fishchicks.org/freshwater-aquariums/triparental-care-in-jewel-cichlids/
Also appears to be a hybrid crossing between Hemichromis lifalili (AKA H. sp. "moanda") and Hemichromis guttatus (being called H. bimaculatus) which from my understanding, hybrid Hemichromis crossings are not all that common in the hobby.
Just some update on my Jewels. In about a 10 week period I had 8 spawns come to free swimming fry between the pair and trio. The jewels have not been so prolific since. One spawn in April and nothing since. Removed the smaller male (the one paired up with the 2 females in the last videos) in April and moved him to the 90 gal. He was being held "hostage" in a small corner area of the tank by the rival male. Less then a year with 2 males in the tank. Generally, it's what i find with just about any cichlid, that males are not generally compatible over any significant length of time. Pairing up might prolong the inevitable, but since the jewels are the dominant fish in the tank, that amps up the rivalry.
As of this moment, the 2 females have paired up with the remaining male (he's the one from the first videos in the 1st post of the thread) and have colored up. Think they will lay eggs fairly soon.
Two fry are survivors in the tank from a spawn in late January. They are absolutely huge compared to the jewels in my 29 gal. that were removed a month earlier (Dec. 28, 2016). Normally i would be able to sex them at this size already, but with these particular jewel I'm not so sure. With the adults I can see the difference now in body shapes. These males have a particular body shape that I recognize but really couldn't describe. The females have the typical rounder belly but below the dorsal fin and forehead, a body shape that I would have associated with male.
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Sun Jul 30, 2017 10:57 pm

Jewels laid eggs again today. It's not a trio as they broke up with the smaller female and chased her off about 4-5 days ago.
Here's a video of the jewels fanning their eggs and on guard patrol:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0vf5_B9jk0
Even though the eggs were just laid today, the male is sometimes on the far right side of the tank flirting with the other large female. Think I might see some breeding on the right side of the tank fairly soon again, as well.
The two six month old juvies that survived from a late January spawn have caught up in size to the smallest female. Not too sure on their sex yet. If one of them is male, then eventually I'm likely to see another pairing (or if there female maybe another strange trio :lol: ).
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Tue Aug 01, 2017 6:02 pm

Eggs have hatched in around 48 hours. They have placed their wrigglers in the black brush algae up the wall of the tank. Some of the wrigglers can sometimes be seen in the video (the white dots on the algae):https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lV1Jo2sSIRY
Other then in the video of the 2nd post of this thread (where a trio strangely placed the wrigglers way high up in the plastic plants!) all the previous spawns have been more typical of where I have known most substrate spawners to place their wrigglers. The wrigglers are placed in a mass either right there in the breeding cave or just outside the breeding cave. Since there is no substrate to dig a pit, maybe the jewels see placing them in the 'plants' as more secure. Though it's 9 spawns in a row where they have kept them in a mass on the floor of the tank in what i know to be the more typical way.
They do stay put better in the black brush algae then they did in the plastic plant, but some do fall so a number are always on the bottom of the tank. Sometimes the jewels pick them up and spit them back into the algae, though the short video does not show them doing this.
Before the fry become free swimming, I'll have to unplug the power head, other wise the fry will get blown across the tank and quickly eaten up :lol: . I suppose if the jewels really were a major aggression problem with fry, it would be a quick way to relieve pressure in the tank by doing nothing at all, although it is not hard to pull out a siphon hose and remove fry. IME, fish that have bred many times tend to be a little more confident and relaxed with fry and tend not to over react too much. In a fairly heavily stocked tank, straying too far from the school of fry to chase away, potentially gives somebody the opportunity to swoop in and eat some fry. Not expecting the 10th time in this tank to be all that different then the last 9......if anything they are likely to be a little more laid back.
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Sat Aug 05, 2017 6:41 pm

Fry became free swimming last night. As expected, based on the number of wrigglers I could see, this batch is very small (~20). Maybe the BN pleco or CAE managed to get some eggs at night time, who knows, not that it would really matter as I have zero intention of keeping any. As far as future generations, I already have two in this tank who are survivors of a late January spawn, as well as another 10 that come from a late December spawn (and were just moved to the 90 gal. yesterday). Not too sure how many of these I will keep long term, if any at all.
10th jewel spawn in the tank to come to free swimming fry:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isHUPTMYro8
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Sun Jul 29, 2018 11:18 am

Some updates on this tank over the course of the last year.
Jewels have not been so prolific. About 5-6 spawns over the last year with only 3 producing a small amount of fry (similar to the last video, with maybe a few more fry). Considered 2 likely possibilities for the small number of fry: they are placing the wrigglers too close to the power head and they are getting blown across the tank or they are getting eaten by the many demasoni fry in the tank. I have unplugged the power head shortly after the eggs are being laid so I have now concluded that predation is the likely explanation.
Early in the new year, one of the younger males became dominant so I removed the other 2 males. This young male bred with the pair of females, now making it 3 males this pair of females has bred with.
The ridiculous growth rate that the 2 young males had surviving in this tank I believe has a lot to do with having large numbers of demasoni fry to supplement their diet. First time i have ever had some jewel fry survive in a tank with out having removed them. IME, very common with convicts to have fry as survivors in the community tank and I once had 2 female cons that were 4" at 10 months of age which is humungus for a female con at that age, and I believe eating the fry of succeeding spawns played a large role in their super fast growth rate.
Anyways, now at 1 1/2 year age, the males from a batch removed are now all larger then the male that was a survivor in the tank. At 6 months of age this entire batch were all smaller then jewels would typically be at this age. But now they are larger, so slow or fast growth rate at an early age does not always have much to do with later stages of growth.
Just recently, I replaced the male in this 75 gal. with the largest male and also got rid of one of the older females. So it now consists of 1 young male, 2 young females and the 2 older females. I am currently considering getting rid of the smallest young female as it's really not doing as well as the others. The newly introduced young male is now paired up with the larger of the young females, but is also flirting with the older females. The remaining 6 males I currently have are all in the 180 gal.
When you breed fish and keep some you eventually have to make decisions on which adults to keep. I have a tendency to favour the younger generations (Mystery box?, don't know what it will become). I had 4 male demasoni in 4 tanks....decided to keep 2 (180 gal and 90 gal.) and replace 2 with younger males. When I removed the dominant male in this 75 gal. and put the younger smaller male in, sort of an all out war broke out amongst the group of demasoni females. Two were casualties, but it is now settled down. For the first time, no breeding for a number of months as the male was subordinate to the larger females. So no demasoni fry in the tank. But that will soon change as I witnessed them doing their breeding act a couple nights ago.
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Sun Nov 11, 2018 4:26 pm

As sort of side note, I am now witnessing a trio or "3some" with my convicts in the 125 gal. Always thought of this possibility with convicts and thought I would eventually see it with convicts at some point. Female pairing with cons are quite common.......though i have yet to see female con pairings as long as there is larger, dominant males in the tank. That is, until now.
There are 6 females and 3 male convicts in my 125 gal. They are all 2 1/2 years old ( except 2 of the striped females that are 3 years old). The 2 pink female cons have recently paired up together and defend together as a team, especially against other rival female convicts. Yesterday, this pair of 'pink' females was paired up with the 'pink' male. They were all together as one team! Today, the pair of 'pink females have switched males and have formed a team with one of the striped males. I think it likely they will breed together as one team fairly soon, and will witness something similar to my jewels. Time will tell.
A while back a new trio formed for a little while, with my jewels. The dominant female with the young female and male. No breeding yet with this new trio, and as of today, doesn't appear the 2 females are still together.
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Re: Jewel Cichlid 3some

Postby BC in SK » Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:16 am

I should know better then try to predict what convicts are going to do from one day to the next :lol:
The day after I last posted (nov. 12), one of the pink females laid eggs. The other pink female was clearly no longer paired with the other. Male flirts with at least 2 females fairly close by but doesn't let them get too close to the eggs. The pink female with the eggs, never leaves her eggs even for a second, not even to eat----typical of females that have done it a few times in tanks with a fair number of fish.
IF I ever see anything similar in convicts, as I have witnessed a trio with jewels, it's not happening yet.
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