Illness, Health & Nutrition • Possible bloat?

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Possible bloat?

Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Tue May 01, 2012 6:18 pm

A few months back i lost a white convict cichlid to something that made her look like a pinecone. I now suspect that one of my other fish has it as well. I checked the water properties and they are all normal for my cichlid species; the only thing that is off(maybe) is the temperature which is a degree or two off.
My "sick" cichlid is red around his mouth, his mouth is extended and not relaxed as usual and he is slightly bloated. I have treated the tank twice with metronidazole which seemed to give him his appatite back but failed to cure his bloating. About a week later he lost his appatite again. I have put pee's in the tank hoping they would ease his ailing intestines but have yet to see him pass any waste.
Today i bought a gravel pump and did a 50% water change, putting in the appropriate chemicals to dechlorinate the water. Afterwards i put in the medication and, i dont know if im imagining this, he looked slightly better after about a half hour.
The tank is established and has been for 10 years the fish in it are 10 years old and this is the first problem i have had. The tank is 20 gallons well aerated and houses four fish. I do not wish to move the ailing fish because the 2 other tanks that we have have had at least one bout of infection (from newly added fish).
Is there anything else that i can do for them? I really dont want to lose any of them and think of them as a member of the family(they each have names). Any ideas as to what could cause the fish to lose his appatite, suck for air, redden and bloat? Could it be malowi bloat? Should i move him? I just dont want to stress him and really hope that there is someone out there that can help me cure my sick fish. Thank you in advance and if there is any other info needed please dont hesitate to ask.
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Postby GTZ » Tue May 01, 2012 10:44 pm

Check the Bloat article below, specifically for epsom salt dosages.
What was your metro dosage and schedule?
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Wed May 02, 2012 6:56 am

The past 2 or 3 times i have alternated between 2 and 1 scoops(i guess). In your opinion should i quarentine him? Would he be better put in a different tank?
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Postby GTZ » Wed May 02, 2012 8:07 am

You can treat the entire tank without issues.
A higher dosage along with epsom salt may do the trick. Increase to 2 scoops per 10g. Dose daily with a 30-40% water change before each dosage. Remember to add epsom salt to the new water, or add as you're filling. For the initial epsom salt dosage, add it slowly over 4-5 hours, 2 tbsp per 10g. Check the article for more details.
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Wed May 02, 2012 12:59 pm

Thank you. So i can treat the tank with the other 3 fish in the tank? Would there be any side effects on the other three if they dont really show signs of bloat? And is epsom salt safe for the other 3 as well or is there some kind of thing that will happen to the normal fish?
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Postby GTZ » Wed May 02, 2012 11:12 pm

It's possible that bloat could spread to the other fish, so treating the entire tank would be considered preventative.
What are the species of fish in the tank? I should have asked earlier but misread and thought it was a convict along with 3 other central american fish.
75G L. caeruleus (Lundo Is.) | Ps. demasoni | Met. greshakei
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Thu May 03, 2012 7:40 am

Ok sounds good and yeah all four are pink convict cichlids of varying sizes. Does that make a difference as to how i should treat?
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Postby GTZ » Thu May 03, 2012 8:21 am

1Cichlid17LoVeR7 wrote:Ok sounds good and yeah all four are pink convict cichlids of varying sizes. Does that make a difference as to how i should treat?

Nope. :thumb:
75G L. caeruleus (Lundo Is.) | Ps. demasoni | Met. greshakei
55G WC Cynotilapia sp. 'hara' | Metriaclima sp. 'elongatus chewere'
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Thu May 03, 2012 8:26 am

Allright, so this morning i woke up and he looks like he's gasping less than he was and also looks like his mouth is more relaxed and in a more natural position. So treat for 5 days and any idea when i should be seeing improvement? Thank you so much for the help youve given it has been an incedible help.
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Postby GTZ » Thu May 03, 2012 8:58 pm

A lot depends on what the actual problem is. There are a number of different ailments that could be causing the symptoms you're seeing. I'd give it 5-7 days to see a noticeable improvement.
75G L. caeruleus (Lundo Is.) | Ps. demasoni | Met. greshakei
55G WC Cynotilapia sp. 'hara' | Metriaclima sp. 'elongatus chewere'
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Thu May 03, 2012 9:28 pm

Ok and, without a pciture just from the description, does it sound like theres a good chance of recovery? I meen obviously once his scales pinecone he's just lost. I understand if you have no idea thank you for the help
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Fri May 04, 2012 1:21 pm

Oh and will the meds and salt fix the bloating itself or just give him his appitite back and get rid of the bacteria?
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Postby GTZ » Fri May 04, 2012 9:04 pm

If it's bloat and the fish appears bloated, it's often too late.
Impossible to predict recovery if the fish is bloated due to an obstruction or infection or other cause.
Medicating will reduce the number of flagellates (parasites) which obstruct the digestive system.
Epsom salt will act as a laxative and will help the fish to pass excess mucus which is produced due to the increased number of flagellates.
75G L. caeruleus (Lundo Is.) | Ps. demasoni | Met. greshakei
55G WC Cynotilapia sp. 'hara' | Metriaclima sp. 'elongatus chewere'
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Malawi Bloat
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Postby 1Cichlid17LoVeR7 » Fri May 04, 2012 10:07 pm

Ok but everything I've read says that when they loat they pass away with a week, he's been bloated for like a year or two
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Postby GTZ » Sat May 05, 2012 10:27 am

1Cichlid17LoVeR7 wrote:he's been bloated for like a year or two

You might have mentioned that sooner ;)
So, unlikely that it's 'bloat'. Other possibilities are internal obstruction of some kind, but not severe enough to cause death, some kind of internal growth or tumor, overfeeding or possibly a kidney affliction of some kind.
Whatever the cause is, it sounds like it has progressed to the point where it's affecting the fish's appetite which is never a good sign. Unfortunately, treatment is something of a crapshoot from here on out. I would continue with the epsom salt and metro for the rest of the treatment period. If the fish isn't eating once that treatment is finished, I'd switch to an antibacterial med such as kanamycin (Seachem Kanaplex) or nitrofurazone (API Furan-2) or both.
75G L. caeruleus (Lundo Is.) | Ps. demasoni | Met. greshakei
55G WC Cynotilapia sp. 'hara' | Metriaclima sp. 'elongatus chewere'
Flickr
Malawi Bloat
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